MORE CANCELS: Neil Young w/ Crazy Horse “Love Earth Tour” Leg #2 & Beyond
As if the news of cancellation of all remaining dates of Neil Young w/ Crazy Horse “Love Earth Tour” Leg #2 wasn't bad enough ... it gets worse.
Now we have the announcement that Sting has replaced Neil Young w/ Crazy Horse as the headliner for the Beyond Bourbon & Beyond 2024 Festival due to “Covid consequences.”
So not only has the Canada Leg #2 canceled, along with 2 Texas dates and Chicago date but Ohana Festival and Hollywood Bowl dates are canceled, as well, per Sugar Mountain.
So that leaves the big question on Farm Aid 2024, Saratoga Springs.
Normally by this time of year, Farm Aid has announced venue, artists, ticket sales, etc. But here we are in mid July and nothing officially from Farm Aid whatsoever.
Neil Young Archives has provided very limited info on what is happening. Although Neil continues to answer letters as recently as yesterday July 15.
So, “Covid consequences.” Really?!
Well, very, very hopefully, no damage done by the needle ...
Labels: #CrazyHorse4HOF, #DontSpookTheHorse, #SmellTheHorse, #SwiftedBreakupTicketMasterLiveNationMonopoly, 2024, archives, concert, crazy horse, festival, neil young, nya, promise of the real, tickets, tour
by thrasher@PermaLink: 7/16/2024 06:08:00 PM
83 comments
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83 Comments:
So who has Covid, according to the ever reliable rumor mill? Neil, I guess?
Lets not forget, no matter how much we want to hear Neil perform in person and want Covid to be nothing but a memory, that David Crosby died from it this year.
It ain't over till its over.
We’re not (of course) entitled to personal information. In more ways than one, this situation underlines reality as opposed to the ideal world of music and art.
covid is now endemic and will continue to kill people in ways similar to influenza.
@Abner : I completely agree. I work in a retirement community that includes skilled nursing and Covid is never going away. Billy and Ralph are both in their eighties, and Neil isn’t far behind, so these men are more vulnerable. I’m grateful they’re still alive, and that will always be more important than a concert tour. They’ve given us all so much joy for decades now, so they owe us nothing.
Peace 🙏
Finally got a new Timeline Concert though. And it’s a banger. Just about the only thing that works on the latest NYA mobile update! The Contrarian is unreadable now.
Thrasher going complete conspiracy theory is about the least surprising thing ever, but that tends to happen when one "does their own research" (ie: watch random youtube videos).
Older folks are more at risk of covid (see: Crosby, David). The Trump jab is the reason the pandemic is over! (Yes, I know it is not actually over and will never be because it is a virus).
President Biden has Covid now. Seems like Trump has all the momentum to win right now, so I'm expecting a 2nd plandemic to come very soon. Lockdowns by October and a crooked election in November.
Don't worry, kids. Kamala or Gavin will be installed as the new President. Your life won't get better in any way, but the Orange Boogeyman won't win.
Watch for Mark Cuban as the new nominee. Maybe so. Or Gavin Newsom.
Ya, so, the virus did leak out of a lab, this has now been established, right?
It turns out that wearing masks & keeping 6’ distance were arbitrarily chosen yet in real life a mask can only protect a little better, & cloth masks are about worthless. And the 6’ thing put us thru a lot of hassle.
I have coworkers whose lives have been ruined by long covid.
Given that Gates is a Roundup pusher around the world, it starts to look like thinning the herd is a good idea to some 1%’ers who have more power to do what they want.
Roundup also fucks with hormones in the human body. It mimics hormones and can really mess with it.
And Roundup is in the milk, the cheese, the meat, the cereals, spaghetti, and it’s even in the rain & every single human tested.
I expect someday Roundup and farming practices are responsible for huge amounts of cancer & hormonal alterations in the population.
So do I sound like a Conspiracy Theorist? Did you know that term was coined by the C I A to dampen public curiosity of the truth.
The War on Drugs: All Heroin delivered to the black neighborhoods was a set-up, thanks to F B I & C I A. Nixon’s goons.
Covid is surging right now and “lock-downs” are possible. I am amazed the assassination attempt on Trump was not successful. It seems they gave him 2 full minutes to take a shot. Or is it 20 minutes?
Common knowledge is uncommon.
Thrasher is perhaps aware of some stuff that some of us have no ability to comprehend. But we can only pray (to the UFO’s or whatever) that a Big Shift takes place in which Love eclipses Hate. Bring it on!
Here’s a song by Chappell Roan that you should give a listen to, for the positive vibe!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GR3Liudev18&pp=ygUXcGluayBwb255IGNsdWIgY2hhcHBlbGw%3D
Your Brother Alan in Seattle
We have yet another outbreak where I work as well. Denial is what separates humans from animals. This was a bumper sticker I saw years ago, seems it was more prolific than I had originally thought. My country is suffering from a pandemic of greed and entitlement. Sadly there’s no vaccine for that.
Peace 🙏
For all the talk of democracy, the most many of us can do is keep ears to the ground and await developments, while trying to make a positive difference within our respective parts of the world. I think it’s fair to say I’m one of the younger ones here, so that may alter my perspective. I’m in a position of having to envisage a tenable life 30-40 years from now, because what else can you do when most of your lifetime is supposed to be ahead of you?
In this sense, younger people have a lot to fight for. Hopefully, they can do so strategically. Note that I’m not trying to divide humans by age. No stage of life is without challenges. “He not busy being born is busy dying” (Bob Dylan).
I recently viewer the 1975 movie Rollerball, a vision of corporate dystopia. Ir plays sort of like a cross between pro wrestling and the RNC. Politics and theatre both have important places, but we hit serious problems when people can’t (or won’t) distinguish one from the other. Sadly, I think a lot of the damage comes not from malice but from reckless indifference. Power dynamics tend to involve the deranged leading the ignorant, which is not a recipe for success.
[Please forgive typos in the foregoing; my touchscreen is rebelling, or possibly warning me against being too forceful in my tone.]
No Richie, this is not going to happen again and for obvious reasons.
Richie, can you tell any of us precisely how Trump will make our lives "better"? I, for one, would like to hear it.
Hopefully, cheaper rent, mortgages, grocery prices, gas prices, etc.
Also perhaps curtailing WW3 from breaking out, seeing how none of these conflicts were happening when he was in office the first time.
Ok, I answered your question, now please answer mine. What exactly has gotten better in your life since Joe Biden became President. I assume you're paying the same prices that the rest of us have.
Listen, obviously it's not just who the President is that totally affects these things, but for me personally the price of EVERYTHING that I have to deal with (rent, groceries, gas) has increased substantially since 2020. I'm just a single guy trying to get by, God knows how hard it is for families.
So yeah Abner, tell me what's gotten better for you in the last 4 years?
Fun facts: the US president does not control inflation (especially when it is more or less worldwide) and Biden is planning to cap rent increase at 5%. He misread it as 15% from the teleprompter but at least he more or less managed to finish that sentence.
Hope Neil and the band get well soon, I know from personal experience long covid really messes up your life.
Richie- thanks. Just so you know for sure, I was not being sarcastic when I asked you the question.
I have not had a raise in three years. I am a professor at a good, small liberal arts college. My wife is a retired teacher with a pension.
I have, of course, dealt with the same inflation you have. But my income level has allowed me to get through this without much trouble, although I have put off retirement for a few years.
I am looking at this from the collective perspective: is the country better off? Increase in wages, more and more jobs, better health insurance for many, and definite improvements in infrastructure. Improvements in race relations? Not sure. No real improvements for the homeless.
There does not seem to be any stopping the ever-increasing gap between the richest and the rest of us. (Aristotle argued that this is the fastest way to ruin your society.)
Attacks on gays, lesbians, and trans people.
My answer is ambiguous.
I'd add that even when the last few years haven't been ideal in all respects, being the "change candidate" or alternative isn't sufficient... it depends on what that alternative is likely to consist of. As bullish as I've been about change as a necessity of life, I'm not talking about difference for the sake of difference.
These are nuanced problems, but our "two-party system" asks us to make decisions resulting in not-particularly-nuanced outcomes.
@Richie Cruz : I appreciate your input on your candidate for President, and I understand your position. Unfortunately I don’t see your choice actively dealing with any of the issues you have mentioned. I see him as a sick individual who has an insatiable appetite for power. He has demonstrated clearly that he doesn’t care for women’s rights, people of color, or the constitution of the united states. I don’t find him to be a stable individual, and I’m concerned that his intentions are dangerous.
As for the other candidate…. I feel that he has served his country most of his life, and he is unfortunately part of the status quo that needs to change before our government can begin to function properly. I believe that our government is only interested in taking care of itself, while continuing to make promises it never intends to keep.
So my choices are painfully limited. I’m being forced to vote against someone instead of voting for someone. I will be voting, but I don’t believe either party will make any attempt to help make anyone’s life better. But I do believe that your candidate will definitely make our lives worse.
I don’t hold your support of Trump against you in any way. I respect your decision to vote for whoever you wish. As long as we can communicate with each other with the ability to listen, which you have already done. So thank you for allowing me the opportunity to express my thoughts on what I see.
Peace 🙏
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Sometimes the “Swamp Drainer” ingests some swamp water. He himself becomes infected by the polluted swamp water. T Rump has done Nothing to improve anyone’s financial stability, save his own. He has done more harm than good and, unfortunately, he will continue to be the martyr to the ill informed. Playing nice with worldwide warlords Is NOT moving us further from WW3. Quite the opposite.
I don’t have the answers. Not sure anyone does. Let’s start with age limits. There is a minimum age requirement for a reason. There should also be a maximum for an obvious reason.
I know. This won’t really matter @ this juncture. But if you are hopeful, or @ least cautiously optimistic about the future, this should be the first edit to the new roadmap forward. Remember, All Politicians work for us. At least that’s the theory.
“How do you know when a politician is lying? ~ Their mouths are moving”.
I will echo Dan's comments about appreciating the dialogue and skepticism of the ability of Trump to address the issues that most concern you, Richie. To be specific, the few articulated policy proposals they have presented are more harmful than helpful to combatting inflation and housing prices.
They propose tariffs on all imports, including upwards of 60%on Chinese imports. That is going to be highly inflationary.
They propose mass deportations. Putting aside the horrible moral and ethical consequences of such a move, again, this is likely to be a highly inflationary policy. You live in Santa Cruz, so you know who is out there doing the backbreaking labor in the fields of the Central Valley and right next door to you in Watsonville. Remove that labor force in a tight labor market (unemployment is at historic lows), and those grocery bills are only going to go up further. The impact on housing may be similar given that a lot of undocumented immigrants work in construction (though, it's also likely that would relieve some pressure on the demand side for housing).
It's hard to see how either party would have much impact on gas prices. The US under Biden is already the global leader in oil production, higher now than under Trump. The spike in prices has little to do with things under the control of the administration, regardless of party. And, frankly, this is a part of the Biden policy that is actually worthy of criticism -- that is that they permit more oil production, when we should be decarbonizing. But, to their credit, the administration has put into place the incentives through the stupidly named Inflation Reduction Act to help transition to a future where our transportation, built infrastructure, and industry are powered by renewables. A policy, btw, that is priming the pump for growing the economy (see again the low unemployment and, yes, rising wages) The Trump policy proposal is to wipe all of that out and stick our hands in the sand re climate change.
So, while I can appreciate wanting a government that combats rising prices, I'd ask you to think through very specifically how that can be accomplished. I submit that it cannot be done using the policies proposed by Trump.
Know No. Know know know. This is not play time . Put it back where you found it. Deep bow to you KN. Well said.
Global warming will make everything more expensive. Trump calls it a Hoax. Pretending it isn’t real is doing nothing for us. It will lead to bigger problems. Trump is a coal guy, fossil fuel pusher. He is bad for the planet certainly.
Kamala Harris is the most likely new candidate for the Dems, maybe Newsom. Mark Cuban has deep pockets but no experience in politics. Meanwhile Biden digs in. Grandpa doesn’t want to let go of the reins. Biden is so far past his prime; he fumbled in his interview also. “My VP Trump.” He called Ukraine’s prez “Putin.” And this is after he was gonna come back swinging and show us all his brain still works.
Price controls in Capitalist society, rent controls. That is not free market, and Trump will not be helping everyone with their grocery bill. He doesn’t care about anyone but himself, apart from his direct family. The world has rarely seen a man as selfish & greedy.
The 2 party system aids the 1%, not the people. It’s called Oligarchy. As far as I can tell, we are all screwed.
But at least we have excellent taste in Neil Young music!
Your Brother Alan in Seattle
I fully appreciate the vibrant array of perspectives on here, particularly the commitment to both civility and steadfast truth-speaking. “If we close our eyes to the other side we’re just half of what we can be” (T. Sands, Let the Circle Be Wide). Note that this approach necessitates good faith, and good will, from all sides.
In that spirit, I’m aware my recent comment referred to the RNC. But in many respects, it may as well cover any event sponsored by or held on behalf of any political entity. Theoretically speaking they work for us—not that you’d know it much of the time.
For what it may be worth, the most unsafe I have felt in the last few years was on 01/06/2021. Take what you will from that, but no degree of double talk or narrative control is going to transform what I (and thousands, maybe millions) viewed on live television into a peaceful protest. On a related note, it can be difficult to reconcile that the person with whom you’ve cast your lot is not well-liked, but it’s a plain fact that Trump’s supporters, whether they like it or not, have backed a highly divisive horse.
Well; President Biden has decided to step down from the race. I think it will be remembered as an unselfish act for his country. Now we wait to see who will be next in line to attempt to win this nightmare political contest. Our future hangs in the balance, so I hope the democrats make the right decision. Essentially since none of us will have a say in who runs. This is not unprecedented, but a rare event nonetheless. Fingers crossed for sanity to prevail.
Peace 🙏
Much respect for Biden. I seriously doubt Trump would’ve done the same if tables were turned. Which, btw, they should be.
What's ironic about Jan 6 and what happened last week in Pennsylvania is that in both cases only one person was killed, and in both cases it was an unarmed Trump supporter.
One of the hardest things to do is to realize that you have had the wool pulled over your eyes pretty much your whole life. Backing the Establishment these days is the easy route. You're in line with the mainstream media, you're in line with most of the major universities, you're in line with most of the entertainment industry, you're in line with the Elites. What else are you in line with, though?
Trump is a threat to democracy? Trump just took a bullet for democracy. And if you're buying the "lone gunman who was a loner weirdo" theory, you're obviously no student of history. Trump is now in the category of Lincoln, JFK, RFK, MLK, Malcolm X, John Lennon. Heroes who tried to fight the War Pig, citizen dividing, bought and paid media, military industrial complex that has been running this country since the end of WW2, if not longer. You think they would try to take Trump out if he went along with the program?
Do I feel bad or guilty for being a Trump supporter? Not one iota. The question for you guys is, do any of you feel bad for constantly supporting the Establishment? Do you ever wonder why you're on the side of neverending wars, having your thoughts and actions controlled by the mainstream media?
Are you happy with an open border policy that has allowed MILLIONS of undocumented men from God knows where pour into this country to rape, attack, or murder our citizens, most of whom so far have been young women and children. We're not talking about lettuce pickers from Watsonville here, we're talking about people with real hate in their hearts, hate for this country and the people that live in it.
Is Trump perfect? Of course not, but right now I take him over any of the Establishment candidates that will oppose him. And I just wish that the rest of you would at least consider backing him as well. Someone said that as a Trump supporter I have my head in the sand. Kind of ironic coming from someone who will do nothing but vote for an Elite system that has done nothing for anyone below their class.
Trump has lost money since he's ventured into politics, he's also been vilified unfairly as a Nazi, been impeached twice, had his home raided, been indicted and convicted, and has been shot at. Meanwhile, how bout the bank accounts of folks like Bush, Cheney, Obama, Pelosi, McConnell, Biden etc since they got into politics?
And for the record, the United States isn't a democracy, it's a Republic.
Wow, as I was typing my last thought provoking (I hope) post, Biden drops out. This makes that convention coming up an awfully interesting situation. Who are they gonna run against the Boogeyman?
I do believe that Democrats will get a major boost just not having Biden run, he was toast against Trump. Honestly though, I don't think that whoever they pick will beat Trump in November, but this could give the Dems enough momentum to win important House and Senate races. Sometimes you can have addition through subtraction, and getting Biden out of the picture fits that narrative.
Ultimately, I do see Trump still winning in November. Unless they're more successful the next time they try to "take him out". Wink wink.
@Richie Cruz : Your passion is admirable, but most of the information you stated is either unsubstantiated, or completely false. I work with many people who have migrated to the U. S. and they are honest hard working people who are intelligent and loving individuals. Blanket statements are part of my problem with your candidate. Saying something with authority doesn’t mean make it fact. I learned in debate class that an argument from either side can appear factual by using information out of context. I spent 16 years in Arizona where the Hispanic population is higher than where I live today, and each and every one of them was hard working, and intelligent.
You claim that those who disagree with your choice have wool pulled over their eyes, but unfortunately this is true for both parties. Yes; we have all been manipulated by the media. But I don’t watch the news, or have a Facebook account. I go by what I see, and hear from those people attempting to run my country. I have been able to use critical thinking which is being assaulted by this Information age we live in, and I see your choice as the wrong person to accomplish what you are seeking. He is every bit part of the system you are rallying against. I’m with you that we need to stop the status quo in government, but Trump isn’t it. He’s as corrupt as the rest of them.
I’m not looking for someone who is perfect, but what I am seeking is someone who is sane.
Peace 🙏
Dan, so there haven't been any murders of young women and children from illegal immigrants at an alarming rate in the last year? You might want to check your sources, my friend.
Speaking of blanket statements, why are you equating what I said about these monsters with a total hatred of all immigrants? I live in Santa Cruz, trust me I deal with Hispanics every day. Heck, I've even lived with a couple, worked with many, and are friends with quite a few. Those aren't the people I'm talking about, though. In the last couple of years, it's not just families of hard workers crossing the border. We are also letting in other countries criminals and gang members, prisoners who other countries are happy to get rid of. If you don't see that at this point, I'm not sure what to say.
My grandparents came here from Italy way back when, and they became citizens the right way. Illegal immigration is still illegal.
A few notes in no particular order:
1) Humility is an underrated quality. It is also largely incompatible with machismo or excessive ego.
2) I’ve never thought the system was wonderful, nor that there was an ideal candidate, but I’m not to proud to be pragmatic. I try to avoid Us vs. Them. It’s not about what or who I’m against—but what I’m for.
3) If we must split hairs, the usual phrase is “a democracy in a republic.” Doesn’t really matter here, as both party names are effectively meaningless placeholders.
4)By running as a Republican, Trump proves that he needs to work from within the system. Just because he says, loudly, that he’s an outsider that doesn’t make it true. Since when was an ultra-wealthy New York businessman outside the power structure in America? Wealth buys influence—that’s a root problem.
5) Vote for Trump, you’re also voting for a GOP administration and all their policies. A vote for a candidate is always, to some degree, a vote for their coalition. At the least, many people see Trump as an opportunity for their ulterior ends. You don’t get to separate the parts you like from the ones you don’t like.
6) He took a bullet for his own ego. No individual equates to or represents democracy. I abhor violence but the man is in a mess of his own making.
7) MAGA is what counterculture can look like with too little soul. Sadly, that happens when a movement is based on grievances and resentment. Mostly, I see people whose grievances are being exploited by other people looking to push their own agendas.
"He took a bullet for his own ego". Wow....
Seeing how Double Fantasy became a best selling album, I'm guessing you feel John Lennon did the same? What a ridiculous premise.
Here's hoping someone with a smaller case of TDS can ponder what I have to say a little more fairly. A statement like the one above proves that some are unfortunately too far gone.
@Richie Cruz : would you possibly have a source for the information in the following quote that you have provided.
“In the last couple of years, it's not just families of hard workers crossing the border. We are also letting in other countries criminals and gang members, prisoners who other countries are happy to get rid of”.
Your statement sounds as if this is an epidemic of violence. I have read nothing about this being anything other than a few isolated incidents.
Peace🙏
Addendum: if you make a statistical claim, it’s for you to support it. “Alarming rate”, apart from being ambiguous, are scare words found in numerous write-ups. I just don’t see the independent thought in that. I’m not aiming for sarcasm. Rethinking stock phrases is a good starting point for fresh ideas.
People are struggling and hurting. They want simple answers, straightforward solutions. I can understand all that. In my experience, people who blame things on immigration (without looking more deeply into problems) are often looking for reasons to cast out those who look different, speak different languages, etc. Whichever sources you’re hearing from, they may have ulterior motives. I feel like I’m stating the obvious, but it’s fact people sometimes overlook when the source aligns with a narrative they’ve already settled on. “It feels right, so it must be true” is a particularly hazardous fallacy.
@Meta : Absolutely correct, and thank you.
One of the recent details that has frustrated me deeply is, “Trump took a bullet for democracy”. He was grazed by the assailants bullet. The whole thing is an abhorrent insult to military personnel who have been killed protecting our freedom. The fact that Trump is using this incident for his own political gain is repugnant. If this alone doesn’t illustrate his true character, then I don’t know what to say.
Peace 🙏 (please)
That damn Trump. The fact that his head didn't get blown off only proves how awful and dangerous he really is. And speaking of military personnel, how bout those 13 soldiers left to die in Afghanistan? Fewer American soldiers died under Trump than any other President in the last half century, only proving how much of a Nazi he truly is, right guys?
And Dan, I'm glad that only a "few isolated incidents" of illegal immigrants killing innocent American women and children isn't quite enough to get you stirred up about the border. How bout the fact that fentanyl deaths have nearly tripled in the last 4 years? Will that be enough to get you concerned??
And I love how my statements against ILLEGAL immigration automatically means that not only am I against immigration, but of course it must be because....wait for it.....it's coming.... I'm a racist that hates brown people! Yatzee!!! Give it a rest with that tired shit. As long as you can play the -ism card, why engage in any serious debate about things?
Don't worry, kids. The military industrial complex that you guys support will soon nominate a new puppet for all of you to blindly back. All the big stars will support the choice, including probably Neil, and you can all feel good about it. Doesn't mean you're gonna win in November, though. There are millions of Americans who are sick of the charade and are ready to do the right thing.
First, to be clear: I do not support or condone violence against anyone. It’s intellectually lazy to take one sentence and ignore the rest. Just as it’s intellectually lazy to label other views as TDS. Everyone here is smart enough to know that. I see how my comment sounds callus, but my point was that Trump is not going to save democracy and doesn’t care about democracy.
He never had to run for office, let alone create an intentionally divisive movement to catapult himself to power. Over and over, he’s chosen this route. I don’t think he’s the problem but his public presence is a symptom. I think he’s been so isolated from reality that he has no concept of consequences. He doesn’t seem to care who gets hurt as long as he wins.
Clearly we see different things in Trump. I don’t think any of us are deranged. I’m mainly trying to advocate critical thinking. Without that, I’m not sure discussion can have much value.
Dan, that’s quite true. I think it’s, at best, distasteful to valorize the man. My choice of words may have been brash but I appreciate that someone sees what I meant. Trump escapes with a grazed ear. Of course, it’s other people who get seriously hurt and killed in this senseless violence. “The ones who give the orders are not the ones to die.”
Just one more thing for you all to chew on, and then I'm done talking politics for the day.
Just remember, when you're against Trump, you're on the same side as George W Bush and Dick Cheney. How does THAT feel, guys?
One more from me, too: reality is more than just two sides.
Well……. That ended badly….. so much for civil conversation. I made the effort, and I will again if anyone has the patience to discuss in a calm and constructive manner.
Thank you Meta for your critical thinking and patience observations. This seems to be where this country wants to be. Divided and hostile. I was thinking there was hope. But perhaps I’m just too naive. Yet I continue to be optimistic regardless. The solution to our problems will always require compromise, but there seems to be a great divide that cancels out the opportunity for compromise. I pray that there are enough individuals who are grounded enough to see where we’re headed.
Peace🙏 ( to all )
Dan, how did that end badly? I disageed with you? Now suddenly it's not a civil conversation anymore? People here can apparently call me misinformed, hateful, and politely accuse me of racism, and that seems perfectly fine. But when I call you all blind sheep, now suddenly we need a safe space?
Dan, I like you and if I did offend you with the truth about the real world, then I'm truly sorry. Peace and love, brother.
It's too bad that on a site dedicated to a legendary musician who was never afraid to speak his mind, anyone who goes against the grain gets treated like a villain. Just as Neil has lost his edge which made him so unique, so it seems most of his fans have sold the farm as well.
"It's hard getting blood from a stone, but I'll give it a try"
Dan, I really don't want to end on a tense note. This hasn't been a great exchange, but one point I instructive is the disconnect when one person is trying to use reason while another is relying more on emotions. It's hard to bridge the gap in perspective: if someone isn't fully willing to think critically in the moment, is there really a good way forward? Sometimes it's healthier to step away.
Maybe some are more swayed by argument from reasoning, others by emotional appeals. In understanding culture shifts, successful political messaging, or just daily communication, it's highly useful to be aware of such patterns. How do we temper feelings with reasoning and reasoning with compassion? No easy answers. It's not that the two are irreconcilable, but humans seem to have a hard time holding both at once.
"Where will it all lead us?
I thought we had freed us
From the mundane, seems I'm wrong again
Could be they lack roots, they're still wearing Jack boots
And marching somewhere in the pouring rain
Beating my head on a brick wall
Hard like a stone
Don't have time for the music
They want the blood from a clone"
-George Harrison
haha, of course "richie cruz" says I'M DONE FOR THE DAY, then posts an hour and a half later. don't stop never stoppng, dude.
i don't give a fuck about being polite. you wanna talk sheep? then let's talk trump supporters. the biggest lot of blindly loyal sheep in the history of "politics". trump is a con man. a huckster. a felon. a failure. that's all he has ever been. you think he gives 2 gold shits about you? about 'MERICA?? fuck no. all that egotistical piece of human excrement cares about is himself.
it's frankly hilarious (in a bone chilling sort of way) to see how riled up trump's cult gets when faced with the truth. all they can do is deflect, and engage in "whataboutism". he says jump, they say, "how high?" the same people who make fun of you for wearing a mask will slap a maxi pad on their right ear in some sort of weird kabuki theater of "solidarity".
some come back at me, richie-boy. hit me with some sweet, sweet talking points. i know you've got a notebook full of 'em, cribbed straight from faux news. that's all you cult members have. no independent thought. hive mind. idiocracy is here. VOTE CAMACHO!!
Who are you? Never seen a post from you on this site. At least you're not going all "Anonymous" this time.
“Let’s Make Music Great Again”!
Now we're talking, brother!
richie rich,
i've been around these parts for a long, long time. you think you're being clever when you say, "Just remember, when you're against Trump, you're on the same side as George W Bush and Dick Cheney. How does THAT feel, guys?"
so whose side are you on when you align with trump? hulk hogan. vladimir putin. david duke. the hits keep comin'. i bet you did nazi that coming.
how does that feel, my dude?
huh. my comment disappeared. weird. anywho, to answer you, mr richard theodore cruz, yes, i've been around these parts for a while now. new email address, who dis? and when you say, "Just remember, when you're against Trump, you're on the same side as George W Bush and Dick Cheney. How does THAT feel, guys?", be sure to examine who you're in bed with as a trumpty dumpty. hulk hogan. vladimir putin. david duke. kid rock.
hey, i wonder if there's a fan blog for kid rock? maybe you'd be more comfortable there.
Never seen you on here until yesterday, and I've been checking out this place daily since 2013. Did you use a different name, and if so, what was it? What's your favorite Neil album? I hope it isn't Living With War, Neil was pretty harsh towards your pals Bush and Cheney. Don't get mad at me because you're in bed with War Pigs, I'm too busy partying with Kid Rock and the Hulkster.
This comment has been removed by the author.
What I've been trying to point out is, it's not just about how you (or I) *feel*. It's about thinking things through. Anyone is capable of overreacting in heated moments, but if you never catch yourself and stop, it can become a pattern that shuts down meaningful communication.
If, instead of listening, someone is going to respond to the image made up in their own head of who they think am, I don't see the value for either of us. Life is short and my energy is finite, so I prefer to find the people willing to put in real thinking.
rich,
"migrant crime" is complete bullshit. faux news started pushing it HARD in february, and now your cult leader continues to spread the lies. i'm sure you've watched (and salivated) over the footage from NYC. welp, turns out that the rest of the footage from that indicent clearly shows the cop pushing one of the kids, who was peacefually dispersing. that's what started the whole thing. and i bet you've been tempted to throw your swanson's dinner at your tv in outrage at the other kid who was flipping the twin birds! turns out THAT kid wasn't even part of the other incident, was unlawfully detained for 2 days, and set free with no charges. now, if someone mistook YOUR identity and jailed you for 2 days, do you think you might have a similar reaction?
again, your big gripe about migrant crime is bogus. BO-GUS. those are FACTS. you also spout off about "plandemics" and "crooked elections". you are SUCH a good, good boy. i hope your republican overlords are giving you cookies.
good boy! now, go fetch some migrants! what? you caught a US citizen who speaks spanish (like those fools in red berets on the Hannity show)? oh well, we'll take that too!!
now, sing along if you know the words...."even david duke has got sooooouuuuulllll"
thanks to all for the a mostly civil discussion on subjects of vital importance.
As "The Big Shift" continues to pick up speed, folks continue to wake up, become aware, attain consciousness, seek full disclosure and move us closer to full truth and reconciliation.
@ mr man - no need to get nasty here. we can have polite discussions over violent disagreements.
"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible make violent revolution inevitable."
~~John F. Kennedy, October 26, 1963
Still waiting to hear what your favorite Neil album is, buddy. Internet tough guy, safe behind a keyboard, probably in Mom's basement. David Duke? Talk about a tired record. You're supposedly on the side of dignity and morals, yet can't make a sensible argument without ranting and personal insult. Trump is so embedded in your head that you don't realize how much you sound like him. I've given concrete, solid reasons why I'm voting for Trump (economy, the border, endless war), yet all you provide are psychotic rants and old ghost stories. It's all you have. The tribe that you blindly support provides you with nothing else.
If this Mr. Man person could drop his attack rhetoric he might have some arguments. I asked Richie a question and he did answer it. He asked me a question and I answered it.
I think MR might have made the key point: we have to think before we conclude! It is hard to say where our thinking, if done well, will take us- maybe even to revise our own cherished beliefs.
I have always admired and respected good conservative political philosophy. Frankly, I do not see any of this in Trump's camp. He just yammers and blabbers. He speaks in violent terms and we should all reject this.
What is it that truly guides your thinking about politics? About the common good? We need to develop those guides into coherent and defensible ideas and arguments. Authority and ignorance speak in slogans. (Richie, this is not aimed at you, these are my views in general.)
So, I take rights theory seriously even if I don't always understand the nature of rights. For example, one guide for me is the "right to equal opportunity." This is only an actual right insofar as we can articulate what it means and what it requires. In my view, it requires, at the very least, an equality of benefits and resources in childhood. If this is true, then it will follow that the US educational system is unjust and injustice cannot be ignored. Income disparity across class harms children in ways that never allows them to fully recover and the right to an equal opportunity becomes a gross sham (which it is now).
I have students who are first generation. One I have right now, a first rate talent, has violent addiction addicted parents (the fentanyl that Richie mentioned). This kid's chance at college was next to nothing. His high school is underfunded and understaffed. Up the road fifty miles there are students with every advantage imaginable. This is unjust. Children cannot help their circumstance- they cannot "pull themselves up by their bootstraps" at age 7. If anyone thinks this happens suddenly at age 18, they need to read the science of human development.
The crisis at the border, so called, is caused by human misery and evil. People leave their homes to find a better life. To escape violence and greed. (Of course there are some who are not in this group, a minority.) What guides me here is the moral axiom of human dignity. By harming those persons further, we commit grave crimes against human value. Inexcusable crimes. Under no condition should we cause harm to innocent people seeking to save their lives and their children.
"My heart, my heart, I've gotta keep my heart." "The cupboard is bare but the streets are paved with gold."
Imagine a child coming from a nightmare life, seeking hope in the United States, and seeing the wealth in this country. Try to think of what it would be like to be that child.
Abner, well-stated in all respects. I don’t see anything either original or helpful in Trump. Or at least, it’s a case where the original parts aren’t good and anything remotely good is not new (like the old anecdote about Samuel Johnson). Yet I try not to think in terms of “Us vs. Them.” I’m wary of guilt by association. Maybe most significant, I don’t define my positions based on who I’m against. The key is principles or values I’m in favor of.
Anyone knowing Shakespeare may remember, in Midsummer Night’s Dream, Titania falling under a love potion and walking up to woo Nick Bottom, the guy with the donkey head. To me personally, that’s similar to what it looks like when Americans go head over heels for Trump. Except Trump lacks Bottom’s charm and effacing self-awareness, which leaves the baser qualities of humans without the redeeming aspects. Bottom the Weaver (and most of us humans) is like a dog that sees its reflection in a glass, doesn’t necessarily understand it, but knows there’s something worth contemplating. Whereas Trump, at least in public persona, barks aggressively at the boogeyman he doesn’t realize is his own phantom/shadow.
@Abner & Meta : Thank you both for your input on this topic. You’re both far more eloquent writers than I, and you have succeeded in illustrating with clarity the points I was attempting to convey. The state of our nation has become a battlefield of extremes. Both sides are clearly suffering with the same madness, which will ultimately prevent anything useful or positive from happening. Nothing can move forward without compromise. I’m hopeful that there are enough people who reside somewhere in the middle who can help balance things out. Otherwise we’ll continue to tread water, and eventually drown in our own ignorance. You both give me hope for something better.
Peace 🙏
“Let’s Make Music Great Again” was Neil’s Pono backing pitch to “The Donald”. That was citizen Trump’s NYC nickname in the press when he was a failed businessman. (Trump casino in Atlantic City, NJ Generals, Trump University, et al). Long Before he was a tv star, as the “Boss”, (who got off on firing people). He’s Always been a class act. Yes, even no or low class is still an act. Full disclosure: I voted for Trump in 2016. I bought into the whole “drain the swamp” pitch, until the Chief swamp drainer ingested some polluted swamp water. Now he is a convicted felon. I don’t understand how his sheep are still being herded. I don’t understand the hate speech he incites. I do understand the name calling & playground bullying antics, the tall tales & twisting of truth. I was a child once upon a time ago. I am a child no longer. Comes a time, after the gold rush, we all must leave sugar mountain. Just think of how Great America could’ve been, had The Donald helped Neil make Pono music great instead.
At least we’d still have Pono. /rant
You voted for him in 2016, and now you vilify him? What bothered you the most, the lower gas prices, being able to buy groceries for the week and still have money left over to enjoy the weekend, or the fact that no major wars were happening? I'm not sure how that turns off a voter, but lucky for you this current administration, run by someone not named Joe Biden or Kamala Harris, came along to send everything in the opposite direction. I guess you feel better? Shouldn't stuff like that rise above a grating personality? "Yeah, my expenses have nearly tripled in the last 4 years and we're closer to WW3 than ever before, but that Joe Biden is a nice guy." So strange to me to let personality rise above what's actually important.
Dan, thanks for being here. You clearly have a good soul, very much needed in these times.
I find it reassuring, rather than confusing or alarming, to know that people can change their minds. Stubbornness or intractability is not necessarily a sign of character. It takes more strength to ask oneself challenging questions and reckon with whatever answers may arise.
Unbelievable. You are quoting, almost verbatim, Hillary Clinton: “What did you enjoy less? The peace or the prosperity?” (Of the Clinton administration). First off, I only mentioned I voted for him because I’m an adult who can admit making a mistake. (Hindsight being 20/20). Second, do you really believe that any single term president has that much control over prices or inflation? Kind of ironic how when Trump was running against Hillary he actually said “ We could have a convicted Felon as a president”. But he is the felon. And an insurrectionist. A liar. A cheater. An opportunist.
I have not yet heard mention of his choice of a running mate? JD Vance. Wow. There’s a flip flopper for ya. A self proclaimed “Never Trumper”. Total ass smoochio suck up politician. If I were a woman, I’d be really worried. I’m a girl dad and I’m worried for my daughter.
But you know all of this already.
Still. Blind faith. This is not a re-run of “The Godfather” - Keep your friends close, keep your enemies closer. He is playing a dangerous game with evil doers. How long do you think Trump can keep that balancing act up? Threaten your enemies, not your friends in NATO.
That’s really what concerns me, personally. I’m an independent thinker AND voter. No party affiliations for me. I admit the choices are bad and worse. Unfortunately, I’m choosing bad. Because worse is…worse. And bad could always get better. Worse just gets worse.
Trump is both the most deceitful of all public figures in world history and at times quite honest. When he says at a recent rally " I don't care about you I just want your vote" does anybody even Magas doubt it ? Or how bout this one to Leslie Stall " you know why I do it. I do it to discredit and demean you all so when you write negative stories about me no one believes you " or how about when he said we can't have more voters because Republicans would never win again. Suppress that vote as much as possible especially in the non white neighborhoods. Don't try the traditional hard work of actually persuading folks with good ideas and earning their vote. Nah. We tried that to no success. Now it's just to win with any means needed.
More examples of Dan's very important points (which were very well stated): Trump tells his audience that we cannot have a socialist president and then adds, for good measure, "we cannot have a female socialist president." And, by the way, he intentionally mispronounces her name (racism, micro-aggression).
What is a socialist? Ask Trump? There is no reason for believing that Kamala Harris is a socialist, unless you are willing to follow some thinkers: "socialism is the democratization of the workplace" (Andrew Feenberg). In this sense, most of us are probably socialists? I know that I am. I want my friends and neighbors and fellow citizens to make a decent wage, get medical insurance, and be protected from American greed. All of us should be able to determine, at least in part, the nature of our work and our work place: this is an element in the right to self-determination.
Back to Dan's point: Trump's strategy is clearly to divide before everything else. He does not do this with policy, with well-stated arguments on policy, but on mysogeny and racism (why do people call Harris "Kamala" and not Vice President Harris? Classic trivialization of women and classic sexism).
Harris is going to lay out policy proposals. Watch what happens next. Trump is already trying to avoid a debate. why? Because he is a bully and a coward.
Back in the 30's in Germany one could hear statements like this every day:
"I live in Frankfurt, trust me I deal with Jews every day. Heck, I've even lived with a couple, worked with many, and are friends with quite a few. Those aren't the people I'm talking about, though. In the last couple of years, it's not just families of hard workers crossing the border. We are also letting in other countries criminals and gang members, prisoners who other countries are happy to get rid of."
So I believe the first half of these sentences, they likely were well-intended back then and they are today. The second half however was part of an ideology that laid Europe to waste.
That all reminds me of Saul Alinsky, who in his later life lived in Carmel, CA, not that far from Santa Cruz btw.
“you are broad-minded and respect other people if they know their place,” and if so, Alinsky says almost with a sneer, you are a member of that “great American class of Mr. But.” Mr. But says things like: “Now nobody can say that I’m not friend of the Mexicans or that I am prejudiced, BUT—” or “Nobody can say that I’m anti-Semitic. Why some of my best friends are Jews, BUT—” (Reveille for Radicals, 7).
Source: http://www.asjournal.org/66-2019/the-comic-vision-of-saul-alinskys-community-organizing-tradition/
Sometimes it's ironic, sometimes it's very sad that a German of the 21st century feels compelled to remind Americans of their gifted and talented persons such as Saul Alinsky, that had many answers to today's problems already half a century ago.
You turn my words into something a Nazi might say? FUCK YOU ASSHOLE!!!
I just happen to want to vote for someone you disagree with, and you accuse me of being a Nazi? How dare you.
Once again, FUCK YOU. If Thrasher wants to kick me out of here, then so be it. I wonder about YOUR family members back in 1936 or so. Dickhead.
Where was your family in the 1930's, you fucking piece of shit?
You don't know a thing about me, you smug asshole. Go to fucking Hell, prick.
Direct message to Thrasher. All I've done here is make a case for a President who was President for 4 years, and did NOTHING which represents a Nazi, and I've just been accused of being one. Simply because of who I want to vote for.
I fucking DEMAND that you call out Dionys for his previous statement. I can handle some of the other criticism coming at me, but that was a cheap shot of the highest order. I can take or leave this place pretty easily, I'm just hoping you might come out and say something here.
“Let’s Make Music Great Again” Richie, I forgive you. I stated Facts as plainly as I possibly could and you pull a page from the Trump playbook & counter facts with accusing me of “Vilifying” Trump?
Light a candle (from the largely dismissed Fork in the Road album) played on shuffle during my morning commute.
I think that song fits especially well in this thread.
ok, ok.
take a breath and step away from the keyboards everyone here.
we've let this thread run its course in the interest of freedom of speech. we're glad to see folks engaged and passionate. that's what its all about.
altho we do insist that we keep it civil. please
that said, we guess we'll weigh in here.
frankly the disappointment here is that so many fall right into "The Powers That Be" (TPTB) "Divide & Conquer Trap".
really. check it out. It's working perfectly.
as long as we fight amongst ourselves, TPTB laugh all the way to the bank.
as we've tried to school others here many times, it's not about D vs R. Or Blue vs Red. Or Black vs White. Or Jews vs Muslims. Or Men vs Women. Or Young vs Old. etc
no. those are all false fights. the wrong battles.
it's us vs them. do you know your enemy? apparently not because you're exerting all of your energy toward what should be your partners and not the TRUE enemy.
Maybe the REAL question is do you know your allies?
“The more importance someone attaches to a determination of her identity, the more she divides herself from the unbounded reality of wholeness. A narrowing attachment to identity creates strife not just within an individual, but in society at large. In his book ‘Identity and Violence’, Amartya Sen argues that the more narrowly people ‘identify’ themselves by race, gender, status, religion, heritage or nationality, the more prone they will be to committing violence.
That makes sense when we understand ‘objective’ identifications as top-down phenomena: ideas about how one should be are imposed onto the self. This is already a form of violence in which idea dominates and silences being. When someone adopts a categorical standard for how a human should be, it becomes all too easy to turn that violence against others – even friends, neighbors or family members. I believe that the most dangerous people are those who feel their ideas about the Present more keenly than they feel the Present itself.”
~ Philip Shepherd
peace
Now Playing: "Children of Destiny" by Neil Young + Promise of the Real (Album: The Visitor)
fyi: song contains TPTB lyrics.
I'd just like to acknowledge the value of all Dionys' contributions. Although this comment was aimed at getting us Americans to mine our own cultural resources, what it brings home to me is that we can all benefit from hearing perspectives beyond our own national and ethnic boundaries. Whether one is prepared to receive that input is another question.
Also, there's an important distinction between working through all our diverging viewpoints, which necessitates some level of "back and forth", and personal attacks. One of the bigger, more concerning trends in discourse these days is a failure, or refusal, to distinguish between argumentation and attack.
Stand Down from the politics. Real Neil is happening.
Email from NYA 15 minutes ago :
GET EARLY ACCESS
There's a new Archives album coming and you're getting early access to shop the limited-edition deluxe box set before it officially goes on sale tomorrow. The deluxe box set includes a total of 22 discs with 17 CD’s in 11 soft-paks and 5 Blu-Rays in 3 soft-paks.
Order the box set early today! You can also buy now and pay later with Paypal.
Note for shipping: Deluxe Box Sets will ship from the U.S. and Canada. For UK and Europe, you will need to order from the US store.
Pre-order ARCHIVES VOL. III now from Greedy Hand Store and receive a free 16 track bonus CD Sampler with the tracks from the Takes collection along with an exclusive NYA enamel pin. All Greedy Hand Store purchases come with free hi-res digital audio downloads from the Xstream Store© at NYA.
Release date 5th September. Price for the deluxe set an eye-watering $449.98.
So assume the non -deluxe edition might be a little less.
Hambone in the UK
Too Boo Koo $ fer this brother from another mother, man. Too many “previously released on…”
Kinda disappointed ☹️
Just in case somebody wants to read this reply to all the irate nonsense directed at me, all the others might skip this entry.
I did not call Richie Cruz a Nazi and I do not believe he is a Nazi. When writing about the Hispanics he knows (and who probably know him as the amiable neighbour he wants to be) everything is ok. If he doesn’t read carefully what I wrote and then claims to be the victim of a cheap shot, well I think he should re-read his own writing and mine some paragraphs above.
My imaginary (and yet very real) guy from Frankfurt did not think himself to be a Nazi either, a lot of Germans in the 30's thought that way who definitely would have rejected any affiliation with the Nazi party. To put this in context I added a quotation related to an American scholar who observed this attitude in the America of the 50’s and 60’s.
Obviously it’s more complicated: A large percentage of the population being trained on blaming another part of the population is a decisive factor in etablishing an authoritarian or even totalitarian regime. It’s called scapegoating, I believe.
And just for the record: None of my family was a Nazi, which by the way was not of my choosing (surprise!). And further: German history of Nazi Germany is a bit more complicated than most Americans’ perception of distorted Hollywood characters.
Infact I have researched my family very thoroughly and all of them being of rural orthodox Catholic upbringing (almost like Italians) it's highly unlikely that in 1933 they voted for the Nazi party. After this year democratic elections in Germany were not possible anymore. Sadly enough a large percentage of Germans voted for the Nazi party in 1933 which promised among other things cheaper housing, lower interest rates, affordable food prices and cheaper energy … does that sound familiar? Californians, South American or African mmigrants and Germans (back then and today) just want to lead a decent life?
The reaction by Richie Cruz tells me something else: He does not want to be a Nazi. Well, that's something to build on. Maybe stopping to write as if he were one would be a start. And I believe that it is possible to be a Trump supporter without re-iterating his propaganda paroles and false claims. And yes, I can’t agree with positions of a guy who sent his thugs to overthrow a democratic election that he lost, as has been proven in over 60 lawsuits that he lost as well. I can’t agree with a guy who sees world politics as an opportunity for protection racketeering in Asia and Europe. I can't agree ...
Americans taught me the following lines and I am teaching them today to my students in a modernized version:
“I hold these truths to be self-evident, that all humankind is created equal, that all human beings are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.”
This sentence does not contain: “illegal immigrants” or “criminals”. From the point of view of the original people of your continent it was the illegal immigrants and criminals who wrote these words. The original illegal immigrant was an Italian by the name of Christopher Columbus. I heard that they named a city in Ohio after him.
there ya go, richie theodore cruz. feel better? thanks for showing everyone your true colors.
i remember a time when the republican party at least tried to make us think they were representing good ol' traditional "family values". in a way i'm glad that trump has laid you all bare and exposed what you REALLY stand for.
I love watching ppl lose their minds online as long as not online at the post office ! Lol I don't want to be physically involved mind you. I will watch from a respectful Oregon Coast . The pop corn is hella cheaper than any theater. The Internet is best used for free porn and arguing. This is not a news flash.
@Dionys : Thank you for your measured and educated response. The attacks you received from Richie Cruz was unacceptable and unnecessary. Through your comments, you have illustrated to everyone how to properly communicate with those who use angry and defensive tactics. Personally I was modified by the responses from both Richie and Mr Man. This kind of intense anger ultimately leads to violence and destruction. And will only lead us down a dangerous path to destruction. Both individuals are simply mirroring each other, and they’re both wrong. If we can’t talk to each other without getting angry at each other, then we’re doomed. What’s happening in America today is far too similar to Germany in the 1930’s, and I would encourage everyone to appreciate how dangerous this is.
Peace to all 🙏
I'm still curious how Richie (or any Trump supporter) squares the circle of wanting lower prices and housing costs when the principal policies put forward are to slap tarriffs on ALL imports and deport people (people who live and work here, pay taxes, and do labor that most others in the country are unwilling to do) en masse. These are both extraordinarily inflationary policies. So far, I've heard no reasonable response, just a bait-and-switch tactic to claim that the real concern around undocumented immigrants is related to violent crime (which is at historic lows, but nevermind that inconvenient fact).
I'm kind of sorry to see this thread die. Most of it has nothing to do w ON. But it's a revealing of how ppl think. We have our pompous Abner and Meta Wanker but it takes all kinds to build a village. Is that the saying who damn knows. See that's not even right. Sigh. I'm sorry thrashers wheat I disparaged 2 posters on your board but if that's the worst that happens today it's still a pretty good day. Here it's a pleasant 60 w light wind and clear sky. It's always windy af here so a bit of a break. Will go stare at the waves at some point.
I'am not sure calling people playground-level names and saying absolutely nothing else of substance is going to revive it.
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